Comments on: Epic Espresso http://abstractgourmet.com/2006/09/epic-espresso/ Home cooked goodness Thu, 09 Sep 2010 03:20:13 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.0.1 By: Andrea http://abstractgourmet.com/2006/09/epic-espresso/comment-page-1/#comment-29186 Andrea Sun, 05 Jul 2009 13:59:50 +0000 http://abstractgourmet.com/2006/09/epic-espresso/#comment-29186 Bravo Franco!!! A perfect espresso shot is 25ml by the way. And the crema on top doesn't dissipate like at Epic. Bravo Franco!!!

A perfect espresso shot is 25ml by the way.
And the crema on top doesn’t dissipate like at Epic.

]]> By: Franco http://abstractgourmet.com/2006/09/epic-espresso/comment-page-1/#comment-27697 Franco Fri, 22 May 2009 17:23:19 +0000 http://abstractgourmet.com/2006/09/epic-espresso/#comment-27697 long time that no one write here... It's anyway very funny to read what Corey say.. it seems it's enough watching himself at a mirror, say "I'm an espresso expert" to make it true... Corey, as self declared espresso expert, u should know that espresso wasn't made by Starbucks but from Italians long long time ago, many many years before that ur idol David Schomer started to fight against his own bad espresso tries. Let me see: I'm Italian I learned to taste and critic espresso cups in the 1988 from my parents, and from italian baristi, they all learned it from their parents, who learned it from their own parents... Schomer said he learned to get a decent espresso only in the 1994, in Seattle; and this is a pioneer? Good to know. Well, I always thought that people who don't know and understand the role of italy around espresso are not espresso expert. Espresso is not a bean or a coffee machine, is simple the italian way to drink coffee. There's an american coffee, a Greek coffee, a Turkish coffee, a french coffee. Espresso is the italian coffee. You are saying that u know the Italian way to drink coffee better than Italian themselves. Yeah, believable. Now the point. Espresso MUST be bitter, bitter like chocolate. It's the point of all, it's his body, it's his charme, it's the hystory of espresso, it's its goal. Otherwise without that sweet bitterness it becomes simple "dirty water". Espresso without bitterness is like beer without foam. Italians don't win a WBC because judges are fully incompetent about espresso like u are. WBC was invented by not Italian people who only knew the drip coffee techniques, and didn't understand anything else. They made and understood espresso like a sort of drip coffee. Too much dosed, to much hot, full cups, too much weak from the original recept. It's sad. You say "we don't want bitterness in espresso". And who are u to declare this? How long is ur tradition about espresso? 10, 20 years? Where did u learn to live on espresso coffee? well, you're everybody children of drip coffee generations. Italians, the real pioneers of espresso, do want bitterness! And did always. They are children of espresso generations, while no one in italy drinks drip coffee. A good Century of espresso-life. You can don't like bitterness, but please be serious, don't say that the original espresso is bad made, it's not a serious thing. Expecially if the original one cames from a century of tradition and experiments (yes, we did them! the problem of robusta against arabica was solved years ago), while ur ones comes from a couple of ten years of tries, and from a drip coffee culture. Drip coffee doesn't want bitterness, yes, but espresso does! with regards, Franco p.s.: i remember in the 80's all those foreign tourists in Italy who got disappointed why they ordered a cup of coffee and got that very little dose of strong coffee that Italians call espresso. They wanted a right big cup of watery hot coffee, not that shame!! This was the coffee culture outside Italy... The same people who now say they understand espresso better. surely.. long time that no one write here… It’s anyway very funny to read what Corey say.. it seems it’s enough watching himself at a mirror, say “I’m an espresso expert” to make it true… Corey, as self declared espresso expert, u should know that espresso wasn’t made by Starbucks but from Italians long long time ago, many many years before that ur idol David Schomer started to fight against his own bad espresso tries. Let me see: I’m Italian I learned to taste and critic espresso cups in the 1988 from my parents, and from italian baristi, they all learned it from their parents, who learned it from their own parents… Schomer said he learned to get a decent espresso only in the 1994, in Seattle; and this is a pioneer? Good to know.
Well, I always thought that people who don’t know and understand the role of italy around espresso are not espresso expert. Espresso is not a bean or a coffee machine, is simple the italian way to drink coffee. There’s an american coffee, a Greek coffee, a Turkish coffee, a french coffee. Espresso is the italian coffee. You are saying that u know the Italian way to drink coffee better than Italian themselves. Yeah, believable. Now the point. Espresso MUST be bitter, bitter like chocolate. It’s the point of all, it’s his body, it’s his charme, it’s the hystory of espresso, it’s its goal. Otherwise without that sweet bitterness it becomes simple “dirty water”. Espresso without bitterness is like beer without foam.
Italians don’t win a WBC because judges are fully incompetent about espresso like u are. WBC was invented by not Italian people who only knew the drip coffee techniques, and didn’t understand anything else. They made and understood espresso like a sort of drip coffee. Too much dosed, to much hot, full cups, too much weak from the original recept. It’s sad. You say “we don’t want bitterness in espresso”. And who are u to declare this? How long is ur tradition about espresso? 10, 20 years? Where did u learn to live on espresso coffee? well, you’re everybody children of drip coffee generations. Italians, the real pioneers of espresso, do want bitterness! And did always. They are children of espresso generations, while no one in italy drinks drip coffee. A good Century of espresso-life.
You can don’t like bitterness, but please be serious, don’t say that the original espresso is bad made, it’s not a serious thing. Expecially if the original one cames from a century of tradition and experiments (yes, we did them! the problem of robusta against arabica was solved years ago), while ur ones comes from a couple of ten years of tries, and from a drip coffee culture. Drip coffee doesn’t want bitterness, yes, but espresso does!
with regards, Franco

p.s.: i remember in the 80′s all those foreign tourists in Italy who got disappointed why they ordered a cup of coffee and got that very little dose of strong coffee that Italians call espresso. They wanted a right big cup of watery hot coffee, not that shame!! This was the coffee culture outside Italy… The same people who now say they understand espresso better. surely..

]]> By: Abstract Gourmet : Blog Archive : Hard Copy http://abstractgourmet.com/2006/09/epic-espresso/comment-page-1/#comment-1912 Abstract Gourmet : Blog Archive : Hard Copy Fri, 10 Nov 2006 03:42:42 +0000 http://abstractgourmet.com/2006/09/epic-espresso/#comment-1912 [...] Just a little note to West Australian readers that might be interested. One of the photos I took of latte art at Epic Espresso was used in the West Australian newspaper’s “Fresh” section on Thursday the 9th November as part of a short piece on the new cafe. I’m not sure why I get a buzz out of having my work in print, it’s not like I don’t have countless outlets for creative expression, but it’s still kinda cool. It was uncredited, but I’m hoping to rectify that when I get more experienced in this whole photography game. It was also cropped a bit in the paper, so for the record, the full photo is here. It wasn’t my favourite shot, but it’s still nice to see it get a slightly wider audience. Any cafe owners looking to get some quality shots done can feel free to shoot me an email before my ego (too late) and prices go through the roof… ha  cafe coffee latteart photo cafe, coffee, latteart, photo Possibly Related PostsPerth Food & Wine FestivalCurried Chicken RisottoGreen Bean SceneHome Made HummusLava Stone Grill [...] [...] Just a little note to West Australian readers that might be interested. One of the photos I took of latte art at Epic Espresso was used in the West Australian newspaper’s “Fresh” section on Thursday the 9th November as part of a short piece on the new cafe. I’m not sure why I get a buzz out of having my work in print, it’s not like I don’t have countless outlets for creative expression, but it’s still kinda cool. It was uncredited, but I’m hoping to rectify that when I get more experienced in this whole photography game. It was also cropped a bit in the paper, so for the record, the full photo is here. It wasn’t my favourite shot, but it’s still nice to see it get a slightly wider audience. Any cafe owners looking to get some quality shots done can feel free to shoot me an email before my ego (too late) and prices go through the roof… ha  cafe coffee latteart photo cafe, coffee, latteart, photo Possibly Related PostsPerth Food & Wine FestivalCurried Chicken RisottoGreen Bean SceneHome Made HummusLava Stone Grill [...]

]]> By: Matt http://abstractgourmet.com/2006/09/epic-espresso/comment-page-1/#comment-1825 Matt Wed, 08 Nov 2006 08:27:55 +0000 http://abstractgourmet.com/2006/09/epic-espresso/#comment-1825 Hey Bec, You're unfortunately talking to the wrong person when it comes to musical terms of reference. I didn't pass the musical aptitude test in primary school and was resigned to recorder for the remainder of my time... which I'm almost certain was developed as a sonic weapon by the army and palmed off to schools as instruments when they were out of service. But yes... I agree with your description of body and acidity being markedly different to bitterness (and both excellent qualities to have in the right proportions). I think the sooner people think of coffee as a gourmet beverage rather than a vehicle for caffeine the better off we will all be. In the meantime I'm sure Corey will continue fighting the good fight for espresso education :) Thanks for stopping by. Matt Hey Bec,

You’re unfortunately talking to the wrong person when it comes to musical terms of reference. I didn’t pass the musical aptitude test in primary school and was resigned to recorder for the remainder of my time… which I’m almost certain was developed as a sonic weapon by the army and palmed off to schools as instruments when they were out of service.

But yes… I agree with your description of body and acidity being markedly different to bitterness (and both excellent qualities to have in the right proportions).

I think the sooner people think of coffee as a gourmet beverage rather than a vehicle for caffeine the better off we will all be. In the meantime I’m sure Corey will continue fighting the good fight for espresso education :)

Thanks for stopping by.
Matt

]]> By: Mattnbec http://abstractgourmet.com/2006/09/epic-espresso/comment-page-1/#comment-1780 Mattnbec Tue, 07 Nov 2006 07:09:34 +0000 http://abstractgourmet.com/2006/09/epic-espresso/#comment-1780 I have to say that I'm with Matt and co - I love what's happening at Epic. I am more of a fan of deep mouthfeel (my husband and I call it 'bass', to use musical terms). So what Corey is doing at Epic and what Justin is doing at Velvet are right up my alley. I'm certainly not a fan of bitterness. However, I wouldn't say I'm averse to 'bite' either. Anyway, in the back of my mind is the thought that I wonder if you're both speaking a little at cross purposes - 'bite' doesn't necessarily comes from bitterness. It can also be the result of acidy brightness (or 'treble', to use musical terms again). You can taste it in some single origin coffees - and they're not over-roasted or over-extracted necessarily, just full of acidy bite. I think I used to get the two a bit confused. I'm not saying that either of you don't know the difference between the two (I know Corey certainly does). And I'm definitely not claiming to be any coffee expert either. I guess as I've read this interchange, I've thought this hasn't been made explicit. And again - love what's happening at Epic, and enjoyed the Epic blend when we brought some home too, Corey. Just a pity that pregnant women need to be careful how much caffeine they consume! I have to say that I’m with Matt and co – I love what’s happening at Epic. I am more of a fan of deep mouthfeel (my husband and I call it ‘bass’, to use musical terms). So what Corey is doing at Epic and what Justin is doing at Velvet are right up my alley. I’m certainly not a fan of bitterness. However, I wouldn’t say I’m averse to ‘bite’ either.

Anyway, in the back of my mind is the thought that I wonder if you’re both speaking a little at cross purposes – ‘bite’ doesn’t necessarily comes from bitterness. It can also be the result of acidy brightness (or ‘treble’, to use musical terms again). You can taste it in some single origin coffees – and they’re not over-roasted or over-extracted necessarily, just full of acidy bite. I think I used to get the two a bit confused.

I’m not saying that either of you don’t know the difference between the two (I know Corey certainly does). And I’m definitely not claiming to be any coffee expert either. I guess as I’ve read this interchange, I’ve thought this hasn’t been made explicit.

And again – love what’s happening at Epic, and enjoyed the Epic blend when we brought some home too, Corey. Just a pity that pregnant women need to be careful how much caffeine they consume!

]]> By: Steve http://abstractgourmet.com/2006/09/epic-espresso/comment-page-1/#comment-1309 Steve Thu, 19 Oct 2006 00:50:20 +0000 http://abstractgourmet.com/2006/09/epic-espresso/#comment-1309 Gentlemen, gentlemen (Steve waves his hands around in a calming way) I didn’t mean to start a war (Espresso Wars – Episode V – The Bitterness Strikes Back)  I have to agree with Greggy’s statement, some of us do enjoy a little bitterness in our lives (except when it comes to our female companions). I am in no way what anyone would call a sweet tooth, contrary to the evidence of my waist line, and would classify myself firmly as a savoury person. What I seek (my personal Holy Grail) is the balance between a good strong espresso pour with a hint of bite. To give you an idea, turn off Hay St into Outram and stroll quickly past Miss Mauds (avert your eyes) and into Corey’s fine establishment, Epic coffee. Order a long black. Then stroll a few metres towards Kings Park into Fix and order the same coffee (ignoring the glare from the barista – joking). Now sit outside in the warm Perth spring morning air and taste both. What I want is mid way between these – anyone know where I can get it?  A prize to the first person to reveal the location of the Grail (well, maybe just my undying gratitude). Maybe I should buy a cup of each and blend them? Heresy!  Gentlemen, gentlemen (Steve waves his hands around in a calming way) I didn’t mean to start a war (Espresso Wars – Episode V – The Bitterness Strikes Back) 

I have to agree with Greggy’s statement, some of us do enjoy a little bitterness in our lives (except when it comes to our female companions). I am in no way what anyone would call a sweet tooth, contrary to the evidence of my waist line, and would classify myself firmly as a savoury person. What I seek (my personal Holy Grail) is the balance between a good strong espresso pour with a hint of bite.

To give you an idea, turn off Hay St into Outram and stroll quickly past Miss Mauds (avert your eyes) and into Corey’s fine establishment, Epic coffee. Order a long black. Then stroll a few metres towards Kings Park into Fix and order the same coffee (ignoring the glare from the barista – joking). Now sit outside in the warm Perth spring morning air and taste both.

What I want is mid way between these – anyone know where I can get it?  A prize to the first person to reveal the location of the Grail (well, maybe just my undying gratitude).

Maybe I should buy a cup of each and blend them? Heresy! 

]]> By: corey http://abstractgourmet.com/2006/09/epic-espresso/comment-page-1/#comment-1306 corey Wed, 18 Oct 2006 20:56:09 +0000 http://abstractgourmet.com/2006/09/epic-espresso/#comment-1306 Hey Greg, bitterness is the result of over-extraction (basically when the coffee shot has been run too long). The distinctive sour taste in an espresso is a result of under-temperature brew water such as with heat exchanger technology or inaccurate calibration of brew boiler or PID settings. Under temp water is not an indicator of over-extraction in any way. Bitterness is not a desireable soluble compound from any bean origin but is referred to as an 'undesireable solid' meaning - you don't want it in espresso. In other foods it's an entirely different story so let's compare apples with apples. Bitterness is used to evaluate espresso's negatively as is the case when I use my Australasian Specialty Coffee Association judges assessment forms (based on the World Barista Championship score-sheet) to assess espresso (Yes, I am an AASCA accredited judge). Bean and blend profiles should be a balanced flavour of roasty nuttiness and the flavours of the varietals used in the blend. Bitterness is always the result of poorly prepared espresso. Most Italians as a rule aim for slightly long pours (30mls) whereby the bitterness does come out in the last part of the pour (10mls). We prefer the connosieurs extraction - ristretto (only the first 20mls therefore capturing all the sweetness of the coffee). The sweetness is primarily what is judged in good espresso. A poorly prepared espresso will lack body and varietal flavours but also a balance of aroma, acidity, sweetness and mouthfeel/ texture. Bitterness is not an element ever desired in a cup of espresso just a carry-on from some poorly prepared Italian style espresso (by the way the Italians who are truly doing amazing espresso over there (Luigi Lupi etc) also use ristretto style pours eliminating the bitterness from the extraction and pulling amazing sweet shots at 20mls). Last little tip for you, the person and company I was referring to in the USA post I made above is David Schomer, David is a pioneer in the world of espresso and is probably the most widely acknowledged and respected espresso expert in the world (responsible for around 5 espresso machine design revolutions). And yes he and Mark Barnett from Synesso in Seattle are pushing the boundaries of the espresso process and machine design to that of a culinary art. You can 'google him' and read it yourself if you wish. Cheers, Corey Hey Greg, bitterness is the result of over-extraction (basically when the coffee shot has been run too long). The distinctive sour taste in an espresso is a result of under-temperature brew water such as with heat exchanger technology or inaccurate calibration of brew boiler or PID settings. Under temp water is not an indicator of over-extraction in any way. Bitterness is not a desireable soluble compound from any bean origin but is referred to as an ‘undesireable solid’ meaning – you don’t want it in espresso. In other foods it’s an entirely different story so let’s compare apples with apples. Bitterness is used to evaluate espresso’s negatively as is the case when I use my Australasian Specialty Coffee Association judges assessment forms (based on the World Barista Championship score-sheet) to assess espresso (Yes, I am an AASCA accredited judge). Bean and blend profiles should be a balanced flavour of roasty nuttiness and the flavours of the varietals used in the blend. Bitterness is always the result of poorly prepared espresso. Most Italians as a rule aim for slightly long pours (30mls) whereby the bitterness does come out in the last part of the pour (10mls). We prefer the connosieurs extraction – ristretto (only the first 20mls therefore capturing all the sweetness of the coffee). The sweetness is primarily what is judged in good espresso. A poorly prepared espresso will lack body and varietal flavours but also a balance of aroma, acidity, sweetness and mouthfeel/ texture. Bitterness is not an element ever desired in a cup of espresso just a carry-on from some poorly prepared Italian style espresso (by the way the Italians who are truly doing amazing espresso over there (Luigi Lupi etc) also use ristretto style pours eliminating the bitterness from the extraction and pulling amazing sweet shots at 20mls).
Last little tip for you, the person and company I was referring to in the USA post I made above is David Schomer, David is a pioneer in the world of espresso and is probably the most widely acknowledged and respected espresso expert in the world (responsible for around 5 espresso machine design revolutions). And yes he and Mark Barnett from Synesso in Seattle are pushing the boundaries of the espresso process and machine design to that of a culinary art. You can ‘google him’ and read it yourself if you wish.

Cheers,
Corey

]]> By: greggy http://abstractgourmet.com/2006/09/epic-espresso/comment-page-1/#comment-1295 greggy Wed, 18 Oct 2006 15:23:38 +0000 http://abstractgourmet.com/2006/09/epic-espresso/#comment-1295 I have been following the postings about Epic espresso with considerable interest. I have been particularly intrigued by the intense attention paid to avoiding bitterness in the flavour profile of an espresso. Since when has bitterness been an entirely bad thing. It seems to me that a mature palate can take considerable pleasure from a bitter flavour, many French and Italian aperitifs are intensly sweet and bitter (think cinzano, suze, dry vermouth, angosturra bitters etc). Not to forget the intense pleasure derived from a top quality bar of dark bittersweet chocolate. Could it be possible that Italians enjoy a little bitterness in their coffee as they do in their cola (chinotto) and this may explain a certain bitterness in many Italian and Italian style espressos. Not being an Italian or having anything to do with the Italian espresso industry I can't be sure but it does seem more likely than some other explanations posited on this blog. I also feel that it is important to point out that bitterness per se does not equate to a burnt or poorly made espresso. Just as some seek to produce an espresso with caramel or chocolate "notes" or extreme smoothness, others will look for an espresso whith a little bitterness. this can be smoothed out with a little sugar if desired, but it gives you the choice. To me a poorly made espresso will either lack flavour and body if underextracted or have that distinctive sour taste of overextraction. To me bitterness is no way to judge the relative worth of coffees. As Steve quite rightly points out at the end of the day it comes down to individual palates and rather than simply bagging Italian espresso as bitter and not as good as the stuff he makes Corey should acknowledge that there are differences in style and just because he has chosen a particular style of espresso and invested heavily in it doesn't invalidate other styles. Viva Italia! By way of stirring a little contoversy I'll conclude by wondering if the country that gave us coca-cola, McDonalds, Starbucks, Krispy Kreme Donuts and marshmallows in salads is to be trusted to hold the torch for espresso innovation. Greggy I have been following the postings about Epic espresso with considerable interest. I have been particularly intrigued by the intense attention paid to avoiding bitterness in the flavour profile of an espresso. Since when has bitterness been an entirely bad thing. It seems to me that a mature palate can take considerable pleasure from a bitter flavour, many French and Italian aperitifs are intensly sweet and bitter (think cinzano, suze, dry vermouth, angosturra bitters etc). Not to forget the intense pleasure derived from a top quality bar of dark bittersweet chocolate. Could it be possible that Italians enjoy a little bitterness in their coffee as they do in their cola (chinotto) and this may explain a certain bitterness in many Italian and Italian style espressos. Not being an Italian or having anything to do with the Italian espresso industry I can’t be sure but it does seem more likely than some other explanations posited on this blog.

I also feel that it is important to point out that bitterness per se does not equate to a burnt or poorly made espresso. Just as some seek to produce an espresso with caramel or chocolate “notes” or extreme smoothness, others will look for an espresso whith a little bitterness. this can be smoothed out with a little sugar if desired, but it gives you the choice. To me a poorly made espresso will either lack flavour and body if underextracted or have that distinctive sour taste of overextraction. To me bitterness is no way to judge the relative worth of coffees.

As Steve quite rightly points out at the end of the day it comes down to individual palates and rather than simply bagging Italian espresso as bitter and not as good as the stuff he makes Corey should acknowledge that there are differences in style and just because he has chosen a particular style of espresso and invested heavily in it doesn’t invalidate other styles. Viva Italia!

By way of stirring a little contoversy I’ll conclude by wondering if the country that gave us coca-cola, McDonalds, Starbucks, Krispy Kreme Donuts and marshmallows in salads is to be trusted to hold the torch for espresso innovation.

Greggy

]]> By: Steve http://abstractgourmet.com/2006/09/epic-espresso/comment-page-1/#comment-1285 Steve Wed, 18 Oct 2006 03:11:18 +0000 http://abstractgourmet.com/2006/09/epic-espresso/#comment-1285 Hey Corey, I'm sure you understand coffee appreciation is like wine appreciation. There are those of you who are caught up in the nuances and micro detail of the product and the whole process of production and there are those of us who just "drink the stuff" :) No offence meant but it matters not to me whether the coffee beans are sourced from the Peruvian highlands, hand picked by virgins, medium roasted by blind Afghan monk and brewed by an Icelandic barista on a solar powered hand made coffee machine. If I don’t like the taste then I won’t drink it. That’s the bottom line...my palate. No matter how good a bottle of red is "supposed" to be if it tastes like vinegar then it goes down the sink. One final comment from me to end this enjoyable venture into blog postings... Good Onya Son :) I too am sorry I won’t be a regular as people like you and your team are few and far between in this ever increasingly homogenised world we live in. Its great to find people passionate about the things in life that give them pleasure and I'm somewhat jealous that your work involves something that you are so passionate about. Carry on the good work and you never know one day I might venture back to your fine establishment to see if my tastebuds have woken up yet. Hey Corey,

I’m sure you understand coffee appreciation is like wine appreciation. There are those of you who are caught up in the nuances and micro detail of the product and the whole process of production and there are those of us who just “drink the stuff” :)

No offence meant but it matters not to me whether the coffee beans are sourced from the Peruvian highlands, hand picked by virgins, medium roasted by blind Afghan monk and brewed by an Icelandic barista on a solar powered hand made coffee machine. If I don’t like the taste then I won’t drink it.

That’s the bottom line…my palate. No matter how good a bottle of red is “supposed” to be if it tastes like vinegar then it goes down the sink.

One final comment from me to end this enjoyable venture into blog postings… Good Onya Son :)

I too am sorry I won’t be a regular as people like you and your team are few and far between in this ever increasingly homogenised world we live in. Its great to find people passionate about the things in life that give them pleasure and I’m somewhat jealous that your work involves something that you are so passionate about.

Carry on the good work and you never know one day I might venture back to your fine establishment to see if my tastebuds have woken up yet.

]]> By: corey http://abstractgourmet.com/2006/09/epic-espresso/comment-page-1/#comment-1266 corey Tue, 17 Oct 2006 09:44:08 +0000 http://abstractgourmet.com/2006/09/epic-espresso/#comment-1266 Hey Steve, really sorry that we won't be seeing you back. We certainly put substantial money, research and effort into quality espresso. I would say that the coffee was not actually burnt but probably the exact taste of the bean blend (or origin) used (caramel flavour is a great thing!!!). We actually map our temperature profiles using PID algorithms which makes burning the coffee impossible, but I understand that the flavour might not be the flavour you are used to tasting in an espresso. What we serve is very different from Italian espresso. Italy is not the peak of espresso knowledge or technique anymore. Back 15 years ago the only decent espresso was found in Italy however now Italy is very much lagging behind current espresso innovative techniques (no Italian Barista has ever achieved the title of World Barista Champion but an Aussie has and so have lots of guys from Icelandic countries). All the innovations are coming from Aussies (Paul Bassett), the Icelandic countries and the guys in Seattle (Schomer, the guys at Victrola, Hines etc). Italians created the espresso process but are not pushing the boundaries of espresso anymore. My equipment is hand-made in Seattle from an artisan company who are truly pushing the boundaries of the potential taste of espresso so you should expect the taste to be different. At Epic we have thoroughly researched our product (4 years worth) and certainly have confidence in what we do and why we do it a certain way. The coffee might not appeal to your palate but I believe it is far, far superior than what you would taste in the vast majority of espresso bars in Italy. A quick tip, truly great espresso will not need sugar. Having sugar in coffee is a carry-on from an old Italian coffee style that used poor quality bad tasting robusta beans (that's all they could afford!) roasted too dark and therefore bringing out bitterness of the oily dark roast profile instead of the varietal nuances of the beans. At Epic we use premium quality beans roasted to a medium roast, so correctly extracted will have no need for sugar. Cheers, Corey Hey Steve, really sorry that we won’t be seeing you back. We certainly put substantial money, research and effort into quality espresso. I would say that the coffee was not actually burnt but probably the exact taste of the bean blend (or origin) used (caramel flavour is a great thing!!!). We actually map our temperature profiles using PID algorithms which makes burning the coffee impossible, but I understand that the flavour might not be the flavour you are used to tasting in an espresso. What we serve is very different from Italian espresso. Italy is not the peak of espresso knowledge or technique anymore. Back 15 years ago the only decent espresso was found in Italy however now Italy is very much lagging behind current espresso innovative techniques (no Italian Barista has ever achieved the title of World Barista Champion but an Aussie has and so have lots of guys from Icelandic countries). All the innovations are coming from Aussies (Paul Bassett), the Icelandic countries and the guys in Seattle (Schomer, the guys at Victrola, Hines etc). Italians created the espresso process but are not pushing the boundaries of espresso anymore. My equipment is hand-made in Seattle from an artisan company who are truly pushing the boundaries of the potential taste of espresso so you should expect the taste to be different. At Epic we have thoroughly researched our product (4 years worth) and certainly have confidence in what we do and why we do it a certain way. The coffee might not appeal to your palate but I believe it is far, far superior than what you would taste in the vast majority of espresso bars in Italy. A quick tip, truly great espresso will not need sugar. Having sugar in coffee is a carry-on from an old Italian coffee style that used poor quality bad tasting robusta beans (that’s all they could afford!) roasted too dark and therefore bringing out bitterness of the oily dark roast profile instead of the varietal nuances of the beans. At Epic we use premium quality beans roasted to a medium roast, so correctly extracted will have no need for sugar.

Cheers,
Corey

]]>